It has been quite some time since my last post here, but sometimes a story that must be told comes along.
As it was, someone I had known for quite some time in the EVE universe and I became quite involved. She and I, through the course of a year, became lovers. This may seem rather cliche or pathetic having met via EVE, but close we were. We did quite a lot of things together in EVE and out. There came a point where she entrusted me with her login and password, asking me to carry out various functions on the main of her three accounts. Then came a time where she had to go on a school field trip for the duration of a week. Keeping the faith in our love I continued on, and then, out of nowhere she just completely drops me. Not a word, nothing. As I had been given permission to use her account at one point, I logged on and commited quite an act of piracy, emptying all her hangers as well as the corp hanger. Total estimated value was at about two billion isk.
Well at this, even though many others from within her corp also had her login, she seemed to "know" it was me, and at this point was quite desperate to talk. At this bout of psychosis, I just quit talking to her to keep my sanity. She petitions the loss, two weeks later I am banned for "hacking". After a chain of petitions for the duration of a month CCP acknowledged that she had given me the login information and no hacking was done. CCP also indicated that "appropriate" action was taken against her for this apparent breach in the EULA. All through this process, I have not even tried to pull her or all those around her down even though there is substantial evidence for this. I will not stoop to acting out of spite in this nature.
CCP continues to keep me banned, hanging on a thread of the EULA which can be interperted both for and against me given the situation. Two months of petitioning continue resulting in about 3 replies, all of wich completely bypassing all of my arguments and continually shutting me down. As any EVE addict would know, this is quite a trauma, not only for losing all the hard work put into the character, but also for the sense of community and friendship this game develops. Several big questions to be asked, could she not have changed her password if she did indeed not want me logging in? She did ask me to login to the account at one point, and granted this is done at an owners own risk, is this considered illegal for two who are in love?
CCP continues to block me and ignoring all my arguments, granted I have given some rather upset replies and taken some unsavory advice. Given the position of heartbreak and upset I was in, I hope was understandable. But in the end, CCP is based on a sense of Democracy, that the voice of all shall be heard. In my case, my voice has been ignored and the top of CCP public relations keeps the ban trigger finger poised with a seeming sense of self righteousness and glee. To me, it seems they are not listening, only doing as they, the government of EVE, please. Is this not how Communism works. Even asking for the ban to be made temporary. my pleas are shut out.
This is something all in the EVE community should be aware of in my opinion. Bans without question are not fair and it could happen to anyone at anytime. My story is now out to the general populace of EVE thanks to the website my old collegue Ander has developed, my thanks even though you have turned on me in the past.
63 Comments
Sadly, shooting first and not asking questions seems to be a tendency among MMOs. A friend of mine got permabanned from PlanetSide because of harsh language, however the other guy said even more nastier things, but alas the other guy was the one who organized a mass-report. Nothing happened to the other guy, apparently they didn't even checked the logs.
His attempts at communication/clarification were unanswered, ours were commented only by "Account details will not be discussed by outsiders"
I hope you get your account back
Yes, they said "discussed WITH outsiders". My english skills suck :(
Thanks :) but I didn't exactly turn on you.
We charged on one of your allied ships and you aided it. Staying long enough to get warpscrambled by my corpmates who took you down. I may have been on the killmail though for responding to fire.
Ander appears confused >_>
Fight it Xan, it worked for norris when he kept it up enough. Demand that you speak to a GM2 and that they actually pay attention to what you're saying. It took norris time, but it worked.
[quote]Bans without question are not fair and it could happen to anyone at anytime.[/quote]
Huh? It couldn't happen to me, because I don't log in using a second party's username and password and then proceed to steal their assets. Cry more.
Eve hookups are now my saddest thought ever.
You steal someone's stuff then go on to say you have never acted out of spite..
What the?
Replies, first off I was with one of my best freinds in the same corp ander, I keep my groups from firing on my allies and their parties.
I met this girl via eve, but the relationship grew outside. In love with a person, trying to get in touch leads to desperate measures at times. And I don't try to point out quite a number of things to gms just to get her banned out of spite, for its not like I deleted her character or anything of that sort.
Also, this article was written hurridly so may not convey some of the ideas as intended on sepcific matters.
Mmorpgs aren't democracies, they are dictatorships.
In this case if they've agreed that you legitimately had access to the account you should imo probably be let off the hook. It's not really ccp's place to punish people in demostic disputes.
Then again it was prehaps not the best idea to do what you did in the first place. If you'd gone round to your ex's flat in real life and stolen all her stuff and your defense was (I had a key) you'd probably be going to jail.
its not worth a ban, but wtf man, why did you steal from the one youre in love with? stupido..
The EULA is very clear on this. Sharing of accounts will get everyone involved banned. When she originally asked you to log into her account you should have said no.
But instead you broke the rules and now having been caught you should just accept your punishment. And in future if someone offers you their password don't take it. Instead give them a lecture on why sharing passwords is a bad thing.
It doesn't matter why you were sharing an account or what you did with it. It is the act of sharing that got you the ban.
If you find this hard to understand then please, for the sake of others, stay away from computers. You obviously are too thick to be trusted with a computer and will a some stage cause a security breach which will cause more damage than a theft of pixels.
Tina McPhail
The real BOFH
lol thats sooooo funny :)
Dude. It was a really lame, spiteful, deliberate, malicous and sad thing to do. You should be banned.
Ok, it's not hacking but it's not on mate.
The only interesting thing about this is the potential for real/eve world social and emotional crossovers. I don't know if that's enough to let you off the hook.
Ok,
I think it was a petty thing to do, but in some court of laws, you get away with acting out of character when your under undue stress, which you obviously were.
There are people in the game who you work with a lot, hell I spend more time with my corp mates than I do with my fammily :), sometimes phoneing them to change a skill for me etc.
I regularly change my password though. I think that if all the stuff was returned, and all was set right then you should be let off.
There are two sides to every story, perhaps you should invite her to post her side here.
Anyway its a game ffs, hopefully you will get back in again m8, its a harsh punishement.
Mate, you crossed the line. You brought an out of game situation in game.
If you did this in RL, burglary after break up, would you not be locked up for theft? Your privileges revoked? Removed from society for punishment, and for the safety of others?
Whilst emotions do get the better of me too sometimes, I find it more rewarding personally when I manage to take the high road, as it were. I’d treat this as a learning experience. By all means try to get unbanned, but I do not think that you can blame CCP in the actions that they took.
The only problem I can see with my analogy above is that there isn’t an actual trial system in place for this, and the system is completely closed.
Yeah, there's a saying in my country, roughly transalted it's
"You don't shit where you eat"
Good luck with your troubles, mate.
Maybe a ban was the correct thing to do, but a permaban seems a bit harsh. If you steal in RL, you dont get a LIFE sentance, maybe just a few weeks behind bars or a probation.
I hate to say it by CCP need to set a precedent on this kind of thing. Looking at it subjectively:
Yours was an ingame action, (theft), using out of game means, (logging onto another users account) as a response to an out of game slight, (rejection by a lover).
Taking r/l into eve was a bad move and using eve as a weapon in r/l was also unacceptable.
I feel sorry for you, I know how much breakups hurt, you mention school, I can't remember how hard it must be to deal with that rejection without having been through it a few times before.
It's these things that build you as a person. Chin up and on to the next fairground ride...
its amazing how many people lack any reading comprehension abilities.
what you did - bringing RL matters into game via such means should get you banned and CCP did the right thing as far as im concerned.
If instead you kept podding her and her corpmates that would be understandable :)
anyways good luck at getting unbanned
Which reading comprehension abilities are those?
I find it amazing how many people make off the cuff statements without any arguments to back it up.
sorry to hear that u got banned. a punishment way 2 hard if u ask me.
but most hackers know that eighter giveing and recieving login info is illigal. (and also finding... like in a database or password file)
i would ask another famaly member to start a new account on there name and so that u pay them. and later on pay with time cards
start all over :) its not so bad u are already skilled in playing the game.
Hrrm where to start? You broke the rules and want pity because she said you could log on her account at one time?
Despite if she gave you permission are not you still logged on to her accounts and cleaned her out. Obviously she wasn't going to report you for using the accounts before hand (We can only assume). So who's fault is it you got banned but your own self.
Should she be banned too? Maybe or maybe not. You need to prove she did allow you to log on. I meaning saying something compared to hard evidence is another. She has that on you. The logs of you on her accounts and the piracy.
So to sum this up. I wouldn't unban you and well you wont get any pity from me. You did the crime now to the time.
"I will not stoop to acting out of spite in this nature."
ROFL OK...
I feel empathise with you, break-ups are never easy....however ccp will not.
There stance will be one reflected on your actions within the game. Anything outside of the game they will dismiss as its not there priority. So therefore you in game actions were logging into an account that is not owned by yourself, again ccp are not going to bothered with the fact that you were entrusted with the password. You then committed online theft, this theft was reported by the owner of the account and you were permanently banned due to your actions. I would say a harsh ban but a ban none the less.
If I were you I would argue that the owner of the account "entrusted" you with the password and therefore they acknowledged that you will access to there hangar's, ships etc etc. Thus in effect they were fully aware of granting you access to everything they own. That will at least make they partially responsible for the theft as they knew it could happen at any time. If you argue this point enough and argue it higher up the chain of ccp officials you might get heard.
I guess the best you can hope for is a time ban instead of a perm ban, push for that at least you will get your char back.
Bah women are the devil. If you two had a serious relationship over a period of time (Im not talking a week or two weeks, but series of months) and she walked out on you with out so much as a phone call, letter, or better yet face to face break up.
Then do what you gotta do.
I had an x I played DAOC with. I bought her 2 accounts, leveled and equipped her characters, and then when I caught her cheating on me, I sold that shit on ebay so fast it made her head spin.
All is fair in love and war... next time... use an alt...
Your corp has fired on Sniggerdly in the past. You got caught in cross-fire, simple as that.
I wont attack you if you were 1, but I expect others (even old corpmates) to fire on me when they're in gangs etc.
You guys had plenty of time to leave system when Snigg entered the system.
I totaly second CCP on that.
On a side not :
just one question btw, you basicaly wanted to screw your GF and stole from the corps hangar ? It's like thieving you gf's family dude, that's uber stupid.
Well its a harsh ban, a permanent ban seems counterproductive on the part of CCP, especially when there are even the smallest amount of extenuating circumstances. It makes them seem cold and very arbitrary, a 3 month or more ban would of been more fitting.
That is IF she has been perm banned also, then at least that would be balanced but harsh.
Personally I can understand that you were distraught, if she had just completely cut you off it can do crazy things love. If I'd of wanted a similar effect, my own response might well of been to bounty or get someone to pod her repeatedly but there you go. Its not like you can force anyone to do anything but if they haven't even got the decency to tell you its over to your face or hell even an eve mail then my sympathies are with you.
Folks need to cut you some slack, its not always easy to step back and think rationally.
(Also if I ever see anyone with the problem in the future I will tell them to deny all knowledge of any such transgression, I mean how are they going to prove it was you? An IP address proves very little these days.)
Happy to hear justice was served.
Don't see how you've got a leg to stand on when it becomes to petitioning tbh.
Only thing thats gonna come out of all this is that posibly shes gonna get her account banned too.
sorry but you deserve all you got, whatever the real life sitation, someone trusted you with a pw and you used that against them, fortunetly for them it was only a game, i dread to think what would have happened if it was a real world cash account.
So, let me see if I got this right.
You get the trust of a girl, and get access to her account.
You log into the account and steal not only all her stuff but the property of her corp as well.
And now CCP is supposed to unban you because of that story you told them, which:
- does not give a valid reason for what you have done to her.
- does not contain even a hint of a valid reason for corp thievery.
- is not verifiable for CCP at all, nor for anybody else here.
So, why was it again we should not think of you as just a hacking corp thief who got caught hacking and tries to get the masses to support him by telling some cock and bull story ?
Even if we DID believe that story of yours, and even if you were not being liberal with the truth at any point of the story, I fail to see anything else than you got what you deserved.
I do not know if the responsible guy at CCP "keeps the ban trigger finger poised with a seeming sense of self righteousness and glee" or not, but I know I was quite surprised at the self-pity when you speak of suffering from "quite a trauma, not only for losing all the hard work put into the character, but also for the sense of community and friendship this game develops".
What you describe there is exactly what your ex-gf must have felt when she returned to her character, and speaking of community and friendship in the game when you also stole all the stuff from the corp hangar (what was your justification for that again?)has a touch of bad comedy.
Can anyone tell eve is offline :)) oh and permanent ban is WAY too harsh.
A person is guilty of theft if he dishonestly appropriates property belonging to another with the intention of permanently depriving the other of it; and 'thief' and 'steal' shall be construed accordingly
You commited theft.
End of the matter
^^ thats a dumb definition because Eve piracy is all about appropriating someone elses property.
Its the rl aspect and password misuse that makes this guy a dork.
"A person is guilty of theft if he dishonestly appropriates property belonging to another with the intention of permanently depriving the other of it; and 'thief' and 'steal' shall be construed accordingly
You commited theft."
IT'S NOT THEIR PROPERTY. Read the EULA MMORPG's make you follow - you own NONE of the data in your account, you only own the ability to access that data. He cannot commit theft on data that the girl never owned in the first place. Also, CCP has every right to close accounts for whatever reason they see fit, even without reason. Such is the rights they build into their EULA. CCP decided that playing with someone elses data was bad, so they closed the account of this guy.
DIGITAL MMORPG DATA IS NOT ADMISSABLE AS PROPERTY IN COURT. LOOK IT UP, YOU BACKWARD IDIOTS.
http://dontforgetit.ytmnd.com/
DON'T FORGET MAH INTAHNEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEET
Well I can see things from both sides here. Yeah you broke the "rules" by stealing her stuff & her corps stuff so they quite rightly banned you & gave it all back. Fair enough but I think a permanent ban is a bit much, one to three months would be closer to a fair sentence for your crimes especially since you'd be unable to train skills the whole time you're banned.
If your story is indeed true then the EVE GM's and almost everyone who has posted here needs to remember what the acronym RPG actually means. Yes he did something bad because he was scorned by a woman but seriously how often have you heard of similar if not worse things happening in real life?
(see here for a comedy example http://www.videosift.com/story.php?id=924)
An act of Piracy? Hardly, you're just a dirtbag, smart girl for dumping your ass.
lmao falling in love with someone threw eve has got to be the most pathedic thing i have ever heard probley she was probley a he and didnt like sausage o// \\o
Get over it, you acted stupidly in throwing her stuff away and you gotta accept it was the wrong course of action, learn from your mistakes instead of lingering
>>"lmao falling in love with someone threw eve has got to be the most pathedic thing i have ever heard probley she was probley a he and didnt like sausage o// \\o"
So only your standards for how to meet a girl are acceptable? I think its you and your short-sighted view of relationships which are pathetic.
Personally I don't care how I meet someone, its what then happens which matters.
>>"Get over it, you acted stupidly in throwing her stuff away and you gotta accept it was the wrong course of action, learn from your mistakes instead of lingering"
I know if lost my account getting over it would take years of work, perhaps that is why lingering isn't yet a wasted cause for him?
This is the most retarded "plea" I've heard in a long time. For whatever reason you two split in RL, so like a vengeful prick you decided to abuse the trust placed in you while you two were close and took the a$$hat route. Congrats at being the lowest common denomanator.
As to being banned.. you are quick to point out how she broke the rules, but sadly so did you. Add onto that the nature of what you did and I don't blame the devs.
Look on the bright side.
You 'lost it temporarily' in game and some game consequences happened. You could have lost it in RL and be sitting in Jail right now.
EVE is a game. So either get over or get another account or get another character etc.
Might be a good thing too to take a break and enjoy the RL for a while.
This is completely stupid. This wasn't an act of piracy, it was an act of theft. Just because someone leaves their keys in their car doesn't make it "legal" for you to take it.
Sorry, but you deserve to get banned. I hope you learn a valuable lesson from it to.
Man... Sorry to hear all this and such.
1. Life's not fair.
2. Girls dump guys for no reason at all.
3. Don't do stupid things, like logging into your girlfriend's account when she breaks it off.
4. Life's not fair.
hehe served you right, and that Ander dude is so stupid..damn..
but anyways get over with, buy a new toon and start over...
btw SNIGG is teh lose
Find a new bitch to fuck. There's my 2 cents in this matter.
You are one sad whinger.
You did something stupid, and whine about being banned?
But its not your fault, you were upset?
Get a life, accept responsibility for your actions. No sympathy from me on this one mate.
you acted like an idiot.
never mix RL with in game.
never abuse someones accounts to take a
revenge (which was pathetic)
grow up kid.
account details should never have been shared in the first place - so that her fault too.
is this the first time a girl drops you?
it will not be the last time.
you cannot go on a rampage everytime
that happenes and then be surprised if unrelated people act by following their own EULA which you obviously did not read.
a deserved ban
"...I have given some rather upset replies..."
You smacktalked CCP? Great way to get them to unban you!
This post doesn't deserve to be on Eve-Pirate. This guy fucked up and it' s a matter between him and CCP.
I have done some petty shit to ex-girlfriends, but I'd be very should it ever get on the internet. And I certainly wouldn't ask people for sympathy.
Guys, please take the post down, it embarrassed us all.
yeah dont ever post here again jackass...
Internet love ... Unless you two met regularly IRL, the way you felt and the way she felt were most likely 100% different.
Say, she was flirting happily and you fell in love. She doesn't want to hurt you and doesn't tell you that she's already married with kids. It's just fun for her and you think it's serious. Etc etc.
The result is that you get crushed emotionally since reality hadn't hit you over the head yet when it comes to relationships.
Then you did something incredibly stupid and got caught. When you're 8 years old and you do stupid stuff when you get upset it is expected. Once you start interacting in the world of adults you have a certain responsibility. Being upset is no excuse anymore and you're still used to being pampered.
I for one won't miss you.
Holy crap, seek help, you are a complete loser. Getting on a soapbox just makes it even more pathetic.
Owned
You whinging spoilt little bitch . Im glad CCP banned u , ur an idiot . Banning without reason ! rofl the reason in your a moron. if you hadnt nicked stuff, pirated and generally acted like a C*** youd still be playing now. Im glad you lost it all and hope it stings ROFL @ U
AND YOU GOT DUMPED ROFL ROFL PMSL
hahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahhahahahahahahahhahahahahahhahahahahhahahahahahhhahhahahhaahahhahahahahhahahhah HA
muhahahahahaha u deserve everything bad u piece of 'beep' l hope u rot in hell oh nd if u got dumped hahahahahahaha and don't worry there's plenty more fish in the sea :P
aye, guess u'll have to stick to chatrooms from now on tho :P
While that is a harsh thing to do, she was pretty stupid to leave her password in your hands. Plus, the rules specifically protect your situation, so I think your bannage is completely unlawful and unnecessary.
Don't forget though, it's not as if you can take your case to the courts. They still retain the ability to ban anyone for whatever reason. Sneeze, and they could ban you. (If they really wanted you off the system, you know, like if you were Osama bin Laden.)